okay, more of a question than a confession I suppose for today...

What do you do, as a staff member of course, about members that all your members complain about? But like, they haven't broken any rules, everyone just doesn't like them for some reason? Like, as a staff member, you can sit and correct behavior all day, but if no rules are being broken then like. Oh well?

I think it depends oh what’s being said about them. Is this alleged problem member just rubbing folks the wrong way? Are they being offensive in a way that, while doesn’t explicitly break rules, is near there? Are they hounding others for plots and thread and not taking “no” for an answer? I think you look at what the issue is and determine from there.

I’m personally of the mind that if one person is making things toxic for everyone else, then perhaps that person needs to find somewhere else to go… But I won’t tell you to kick them right away, only as a last resort measure if nothing else can be done.

The worst pretense ever set is that our forums must operate on legalese. Rules are best used as a tool to set expectations with, in my opinion. Communicating and using judgement are just as if not more important. Maybe you'll make mistakes along the way, and some won't give you the benefit of the doubt over small corrections- but you will be happier keeping your space a place you want to be in. Some people are willing to change their behavior, and some aren't. It is ultimatly up to you what happens in your space.

To echo the sentiment put forth by others so far, if it's for the good of your space, it might be best to show someone the door. There are plenty of people who will skirt around rules whilst actively upsetting people or making them uncomfortable. Are you familiar with the idea that one bad apple spoils the bunch? I think a similar idea applies here. You need to cull that sort of behavior or else it's going to have a wide reaching impact on your roleplay eventually, be it other people feeling less inclined to stay because of problem people or other people modeling said behavior because they see that it is acceptable there.

We have a member of our staff team who is dedicated to having tough talks with members. If there are significant complaints (either in number or in content), we have this staff member send them a message about the complaint. It's handled privately, away from the server, and one of two things happens: either the issue is resolved, or the person moves on because they were "called out."

That said, there's also only so much you can "police" when it comes to a community. For example, is the offending conversation/action happening in DMs? That's on private property, and I mean... you kinda took the risk by moving the interaction away from the public property of the server (this is excluding harassment, discrimination, and rule breaking of course). Do people not like this person because of previous sites they were on with them? We can only address the actions taken while on the current site. Are they mad that this person posted something NSFW in the NSFW channel? Then... get out of the NSFW channel, that's what it's for. 

Like, hard to make the call without specific examples/circumstances (not asking for specifics btw, I just find it hard to evaluate a situation without all of the details). 

Just be careful. People complaining to staff is one thing; if they start talking amongst themselves in private, behind this person's back, you're gonna end up with a toxic situation that's not gonna go away any time soon.

o.o

Y'all I posted that 18 hours ago I did not expect such a response. Hang on I gotta read and reply to these.

I understand what everyone is saying, and that it is mostly up to the circumstance. I'm not saying this is something that is an active problem as much as it is something that just should be actively discussed, and man! Y'all provided! I have had issues with people, and still do, quite often, but such is the life of an admin. Members will always have problems with members, and I do give people chances to correct behavior after calling them out. I have also been petty as hell from time to time, but I like to feel that I've grown as a person and gotten away from that.

As far as the situation itself, there currently isn't one. It's just a topic that comes up often enough that I like to address it and see what other admins/staff members do in said situations, in the case of it happening again soon enough. Asking the opinions of others is what helps us grow and become better staff members, after all.

For me, in response to my own damn question. I often do take messages to pm/dm and try to talk to said people about their problems. Be it with other members, or if they are the problem member. I give them chances to correct behavior. If they actively put forth the effort to change their behaviors, then I allow them to stay so long as they don't break rules. But the second rules are broken, it's a very stern talking to and a warning, and sometimes even so much as kicking them out as said.

I really like my members. I always have. I pull in each and every new person like they're my best friends, and in most cases, they do become that. And you're all right, where a single toxic member can, in fact, ruin the rest of the member base. But I always feel horribly about kicking people out without proper reasoning. I can't kick someone out for having bad grammar or broken English, it wouldn't sit right with me as a writer. I can't kick someone out for not advancing plots or being super boring and mundane with their writing either. I can't kick people out for having specific ideas in mind with their characters that may or may not fit the overall theme of things, unless rules are being broken in the process. These things bother other members.

However, I noticed, reading over some of these responses that begging and pushing for plots, which I tend to do from time to time when I've been waiting weeks for replies, is a toxic trait? Oversharing and pushing on a regular basis I suppose is cause for discomfort, but is it enough to push that button, to open that door and boot someone through it?

I appreciate everyone's words and I will take them all to heart and learn from it, grow from it. And if anyone wants to further a discussion, then feel free. I apologize for the long post I had a lot to reply to lol.

we were here to deliver LOL



re: plots - There's a difference between being constantly on the lookout for plots and then like... Hounding and harassing people over it. When I say "hounding and harassing" I mean like, badgering people to reply, trying to force people into something they've already said no to, or consistently looking for plots but not actively trying to engage with anyone.

The latter one is what I see the most happen, where you have someone who sits in the cbox or discord and is like, openly wishing and wanting plots, but doesn't actually engage with anyone, doesn't appear to be actually interested in anyone, they're just putting out bait and hoping someone catches it. Like they want someone else to do all the work for them while they sit by and do nothing.

re: oversharing - this can be a cause for a boot if it gets bad enough. we all have boundaries, and lines we do not want to be crossed. and we may not always broadcast those upfront, which is fine, you're under no obligation to. but there are some folks who decide that no one's boundaries are important, and that they're entitled to run right over them. those people are the ones who overshare, and push, and pull, and prod... to the point of yes, becoming toxic. because it's still a case of not taking "no" as answer. "No" is a complete sentence. It's a full statement. If someone cannot respect that, and goes out of their way to continue making you, and everyone around you uncomfortable, to the point that the chat becomes a ghost town just so everyone can avoid one person...

Personally that's when I'd give them the boot. If talking with them privately on the matter doesn't change anything, then I'd have them leave. A lot of sites and chats have a golden rule; be respectful. Consistently calling attention to themselves, trying to hog a chat, or fighting against a "No" is not respectful. And if they can't be respectful, then they got no place in my corner of the internet.

I just want you to know though, that you're not a bad or failed admin for curating a place on the internet where assholes aren't welcome. You're never bad for telling someone "Look, either shape up or ship out". A person's behavior is their responsibility. It's their job to take responsibility for it, not yours. And if they won't? Again, they can take their bad attitude somewhere else.

I've been on so many sites, so way too many admins who were okay with excusing bad behavior because they didn't want to deal with it. And that really negatively affected my overall experience on those sites. I'd rather have an admin- Or be the admin, that sends off the assholes so everyone else can prosper.

That's just my feelings on it though, but I hope it was helpful in some way.

That is actually rather helpful. I personally, have a tendency to overshare, but we have channels for that set aside away from the public eye where our members know, hey. this is the damn sharing channel, you're gonna be uncomfortable sometimes. I try to keep it out of general spaces as much as possible but people rant sometimes, myself included.

I did read over the rest too, about the hounding and begging and yeah. I've got a few members like that. The not being at all productive to plots and wanting everything spoon fed to them. Yeah, I've got some of that too. I don't think there's really a community where lazy people don't happen.

I do tend to be one of those admins that's kind of a pushover from time to time too, which isn't always great. I feel like some of my memberbase might look down on me for that from time to time too, and I don't want to lose good people over my people-pleasing nature. I brought up some things to my mod team after reading through these discussions, and while I don't have anything immediately that needs to be looked into about it, it's good to touch base with them.

Reading through all the responses really made me look pretty hard at my current member base, and makes me wonder if maybe I shouldn't put forth the effort to make a better community, despite liking the way things are now, I'm not sure everyone else feels the same way. People can be temperamental and staff can only do what they can to try their best. Luckily, I think I learned something lol

So I planned on working on using up two proboards sites I had made in the past that never opened but after deleting something on accident last week, I deleted all sites I had brought back and said screw it, going to work on a jcink site instead but not right now, not when I have sites that I'm on because I can't juggle them and own a site at the same time. And frankly I love the four sites I'm on.

When dealing with members... It's best to be as reasonable and fair as possible. Sometimes you will help them learn that they don't belong with the current group and go find their own ways, while still leaving on amicable terms. You wish them luck in the future endeavors, and let them be on their way.

Almost four months and 20+ prospective members later and we've only gotten one (1) new member. I feel like we're in a catch-22 where I figure low activity is probably what's making the site unattractive to new members, but there's only five members total including myself so figuring out how to keep the discord active without just talking to myself is difficult.

I don't mind where we're at, and I love the members and plots we've got right now, so I won't be abandoning the concept any time soon, it's just hard not to have the thought in the back of my mind about trying to figure out how we can have so many people come in super excited about the concept only to have them leave a couple weeks later and what can be done to draw in more members.

^ Sometimes that's all it takes. My site was open a whole year with just me and one or two other people before we got more people in. I just kept going. I liked the people I had, the plots I had, even if it was really small. Then now, nearly 2 years later, I've got like 10+ members and we're pretty active. As long as you like what's going on, members will come and go. You'll get there <3